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A friend asked me to help ID this Yongzheng marked sang de boeuf garlic mouthed vase. All I have are these two images but should be able to appraise the vase in person this weekend. From what I can see the mark is thickly painted in over glaze cobalt which according to Sotheby's did occur on pieces M & P. I think the neck, not so subtle chicken skin effect coupled with the mark and what I can see of the foot rim, lead me to think this is of late 19th or early 20th century production. Any thoughts, comments are welcome. Once I have more images, I can post them if needs be.

Ok, I have now handled the vase and know there is some provenance to give it some age. It came from a collector in the UK. There is still some pros and cons whether it is a non imperial M & P Yongzheng vase or a copy from either the Jiaqing period or more likely the Guangzhu period, I suspect it is the latter. The vase is proportionally well executed measuring 13 inches high and 9 inches across it's widest point. The inner mouth has been glazed to the beginning of the neck. The surface glaze has been well finished to the foot though I am concerned with the finish of the white glaze on the foot, it's seems a bit sloppy. There is evidence of some iron spots and discoloration coming though on the base. The mark is well proportioned and centred but again seems thickly stroked, it is underglaze. Irregular sized glaze bubbles indicate age as does the levigated foot rim. The dirty foot rim seems genuine as a lightly rubbed spitty tissue removed quite an amount, also there seems to be wear in the appropriate areas. My gut says it's not fine enough to be M & P but not having the chance to handle authentic pieces, it is hard to make a call. Your comments are most welcome.



Thanks for looking, Gerry

With the Yongzheng reign mark that looks like it was written with a magic marker, I'd say the vase is purely decorative and bordering on brand new.

Best regards,

Bill H.

Hi Bill H. absolutely that was my first instinct, the mark was applied with a marker. At first I thought it might be overglaze but on closer inspection, it is underglaze and I'm pretty certain it is the work of a brush. I believe in 19th century copies they sometimes pre-fired the bisque before applying the enamels and this sometimes had a strange affect with the enamels not adhering easily. Might this be the case with this vase and it also seems the red does not sit evenly on the over all surface. I cannot find a mark to compare to this, original or copy. Provenance for what it counts is being told as coming from a collector in the UK sometime in the 1960s. I know that counts for naught in many cases. I see that even modern copies are now fetching higher prices than maybe even 10 years ago if they have the quality.

All I can say beyond my original comments is to reiterate that this vase has problems from bottom to top in the mark and glaze. There is zip chance that it came from the imperial kiln, as the Yongzheng emperor was extremely tough on production there...oversaw it with an "off with their heads" brand of authoritarianism. Your vase was produced by a private factory in more modern times, perhaps in an effort to achieve the peach-bloom palette but with no degree of success. Where and by whom it was collected in the 1960's is of little consequence to the process of assessing it in the presence of its many problems. There is a certain class of collector who believes applied dirt and a ratty finish to the glaze are signs of age when they actually just mean the piece was doctored by a dishonest maker or dealer to mask flaws and appear older than it really is. In a nutshell, you've got to study this subject in depth and learn to see beyond such veneers.

Best regards,

Bill H.

I hear you Bill H, fakers have it easy in the sense many want to believe something is what it isn't even when there is evidence that is glaringly obvious, it's human nature. Most people think they might have a chance winning the lotto 16 million to 1 but they never think they'll get cancer 2 to 1

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