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Subject:Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Bill H Sun, Sep 09, 2018 IP: 76.106.199.250 I was browsing the web recently and found the catalog for a Bonhams auction in Hong Kong on 20 November 2016 (see link to pdf catalog). Lot 42 was three porcelain plaques by Wang Qi (1884-1937), one of the 'Eight Friends of Zhushan. I tried to translate the three seals and may have gotten two (or maybe one and a half), but the third one just sat there looking back at me smugly. It has a large zhuanshu character as the background, with what I think may be two smaller ones layered in the forefront. I've posted pictures of the three seals below, with hopes for interesting MikeOz, I Nagy or anyone else who might wish to offer opinions on the conundrum. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: mikeoz Sun, Sep 09, 2018 Dear Bill, |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: rat Sun, Sep 09, 2018 Seal 2 is 文融画 rather than 文就开心. I don't have the answer for Seal 3, but it looks like three superimposed "seal" legends, and that just like the left half of seal 2, all three are read as white characters on a red background. The second largest appears to be 王, but I don't believe that the smallest is 奇, or that the largest contains any of the 别号 listed in the bio in the Bonham's catalog. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: merely Mon, Sep 10, 2018 Dear Bill and others, |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Bill H Mon, Sep 10, 2018 Thanks a bunch, MikeOz and Rat. Your joint input will help me sleep better tonight, especially by knowing I'm not alone in the world in being unable to wrap my mind around some of this stuff. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: rat Mon, Sep 10, 2018 To be slightly more clear, these plaques are not by Wang Qi (whose given name is 琦 rather than the 奇 I think I wrote yesterday). Rather they are by Xiong Wenrong 熊文融, a ceramics painter working around the same time as Wang Qi. The first two Bonham's plaques include inscriptions containing 文融, one with his full name 熊文融. The 奇思轩 legend of Bill H's Seal 1 is Xiong's studio name. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Bill H Mon, Sep 10, 2018 During Wang Qi's lifetime, any number of other scholars and artists besides him had studied major styles of calligraphy and the esoteric art of seal carving and its "zhuanshu" character set, which were necessities for anyone to aspire to claim the title "scholar" honestly. So there was no shortage of people who could read any of his seals at the time. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Merely Tue, Sep 11, 2018 Don't you think the last seal usually translated as Qichang ? |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Bill H Tue, Sep 11, 2018 Rat, your initial comment sort of filtered through as a tacit endorsement of Bonham's description. By last night, though, I'd found another Sotheby's auction for a Wang Qi plaque (link & image of marks below). However, even Sotheby's description lacked a translation with characters for the mark. So I gather an evident truth from this experience that efforts to elevate my understanding of zhuanshu and the artists who used it are best focused right here in the forum instead on what I read in the auction listings. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Merely Wed, Sep 12, 2018 Here are two Wang Qi studio seals from Simon Kwan book. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Bill H Thu, Sep 13, 2018 In my estimation, if I don't learn the seals, I'll never be entirely certain whether I'm looking at Wang Qi's works or not. Of course, since he was being imitated in his lifetime, this may be a moot point forever. But I do know that the two mark's from Simon Kwan's book are Wang Qi's studio name of Taotao Zhai, and if Simon says it's so, I'll believe it until further notice. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: rat Fri, Sep 14, 2018 nice find! |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: rat Wed, Sep 12, 2018 Yeah I wasn't sure what I was looking at first, but when you asked about Wenrong not being right I took a closer look and discovered that the first two are by Xiong Wenrong and the third is supposedly by Wang but there's not much evidence that it is. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Merely Fri, Sep 14, 2018 Maybe my understanding on Wang Qi still far below you, so if I see wang qi painting with very good seals I still confuse whether it is really Wang qi or not as in modern reproductions the seal is so closed. Below are wang qi seals in reproduction and they look very close to authentic Wang Qi. Modern reproduction usually made in recent ten years ago when prices for Zhushan bayou painting become high. In modern days, if they can copy Wang qi painting so it is also easy for modern artist to copy the seals. This is not the case in old copy painted during his lifetime where the information still limited, therefore the seals in old copy usually have bad looking or even blurry. |
Subject:Re: Wang Qi Porcelain Markings
Posted By: Bill H Sun, Sep 16, 2018 Until I can absorb more of an understanding of Wang's unique points of style, I believe I'll just trust Sotheby's, Christie's and Rat to prop up my standards on correct seals. |
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