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Subject:Jade Blade
Posted By: Kevin Martin Sun, Mar 18, 2018 IP: 2601:704:4:d350:eded

Anybody have opinions on this piece ?
Thank you







Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Corey Tue, Mar 20, 2018

Have you got any records regarding the purchase of this piece?

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Kevin Martin Wed, Mar 21, 2018

Thanks Corey for the question.
I have not received this piece as of yet, Friday.
I bought it on an online auction.
I doubt very much there will be any history attached.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Ernest Wilhelm Tue, Mar 20, 2018

To me it looks like low quality BC Jade.made rough, to make it look old. Most likely made in Taiwan, maybe even in China.
Ernest

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Kwvin Martin Wed, Mar 21, 2018

I will send better pics when I get it.
Thanks Ernest.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Super Wed, Mar 21, 2018

I agree with Ernest, based on these low-resolution pictures, judging by its material and workmanship, I believe it was made modern, made it look old, put in a fancy stand and try to sell it for a bundle. No pun intended.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: John R Fri, Mar 23, 2018

The "dirt" in the holes could help with the
identification of this jade. Swab the holes
with hydrogen peroxide. If new, they will
clean off, if formed by the leaching of
iron from being buried in soil over time,
the will remain.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Kevin Martin Sat, Mar 24, 2018

Thank you John for the advise. Appreciate it.
I will get back to you with the results...if I get the guts to do it lol

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Kevin Martin Thu, Mar 22, 2018

Thank you.
Tried to send you an email, but it bounced back.
[email protected] correct ?

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Corey Fri, Mar 23, 2018

Well, I disagree with Ernest Wilhelm and Super. I'd say this could be real one. The material is correct. There are many examples in books and on the internet made in similar material. For example this bi from Christie's:

https://www.christies.com/lotfinder/Lot/a-dark-green-opaque-jade-bi-disc-5876616-details.aspx

Also the stand makes the jade blade more interesting. A jade blade fitted in similar stand at Sotheby's:

http://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/ecatalogue/2015/contemporary-literati-hk0566/lot.2824.html

What auction was it? What's the size of it?

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Kevin Martin Sat, Mar 24, 2018

Thank you for the comments and the links.
Yes the stand is very similar.
The blade is about 9.25 inches long by 2.5 inches wide.
I purchased it ETBH. There were no other Chinese pieces in that auction.
I guess I better call Sotheby's lol
I actually know Ernest.He is very good and has written articles on the subject of jades.
Have a good weekend.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Corey Mon, Mar 26, 2018

The stand could certainly be a warm track to follow. If you could identify the person or the company who did it, they might have kept a record or otherwise assist in identifying the previous owner.
I was hoping for something larger in size. Had it been around the 35-40 cm. in size or more, it could bring a rather high result at Sotheby's on a good day - >$200,000. The shape seems unusual though, and therefore Sotheby's might find it interesting. But with these things, they will almost certainly require a provenance. So unless they are able to trace it by themselves, you will have to do the detective work yourself.

Very advanced methods has BTV been developed to identify the source jade material, originally in connection of the European JADE PROJECT, focusing on the identification of the origin of the jade material used for the making of the numerous neolithic jade axes found scattered around across Europe.

I couldn't find the original articles on the internet, but there is also this article on the subject from GIA, that also show jade samples from some of the many jade occurrences in China:

https://www.gia.edu/gems-gemology/fall-2015-dolomite-related-white-nephrite-iterative-binary-linear-discriminant-analysis

And yes! Contrary to popular beliefs, there IS actually nephrite jade occurrences inside of present days mainland China. (Surprise!)




Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Kevin Martin Tue, Mar 27, 2018

Thank you Corey.
The stand people do not keep records unfortunately.
I have asked EBTH if they know anymore about it. Waiting on that.
Thank you for all the references.
I put inquiries out to a couple of galleries down here.
I will keep you posted.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Super Tue, Mar 27, 2018

While I cannot say that this is not the "real one' since we all based our opinions on low-resolution pictures without the opportunity to examine this piece in person. But the material of this piece, IMHO, was exported from outside China and unlike the types of "Bai Yu" (dark green nephrite jade) that were used to make archaic Chinese jade carvings, like Hetian nephrite, Manassa (River) nephrite or Qinghai nephrite.

I also respectfully disagree with Corey's statement "Contrary to popular beliefs, there IS actually nephrite jade occurrences inside of present days mainland China"

First of all, what is the definition of Mainland China? Almost all of the nephrite jade, even during ancient time in China, were imported from Hetian, or Xinjiang vicinity, Manassa River, Qinghai, all around the Kulun Mountain. These territories, in most Chinese dynasties were not considered inside the Chinese border. During the 2008 Beijiang Olympics, https://www.gia.edu/gia-news-research/nephrite-jade-road-evolution-green-nephrite-market
the Olympic medals were made with nephrite jade mined from the Qinghai province.
It was rumored that nephrite jade was once found and could still be found in the Liaoning province and some of the OLD Xiu Yu (Xi Yang jade) were actually nephrite jade. But I cannot confirm this or obtain any nephrite samples from this area.
As a matter of fact, since the late 70s, nephrite jade had become very rare even inside China and nephrite jade were imported into China from Russia (e.g Siberia), Canada (e.g British Columbia) and USA (e.g. Wyoming, Washington, California to make high-priced imitation antique jade pieces. Of course, it may still be possible to find traces of nephrite jades in "mainland" China but the quantity of them is so negligible to mean anything.




Subject:National Geographic Sept. 1987 article about jade
Posted By: Super Wed, Mar 28, 2018

I probably should say scarce instead of rare.
In the Sept. 1987 issue of National Geographic, according to the article "The Jade Stone of Heaven" during the 80s it was both difficult and expensive to find nephrite for making jade fakes.

You can find a copy of that issue here:

https://nationalgeographicbackissues.com/national-geographic-1980-1989-back-issues/national-geographic-september-1987.html

https://www.amazon.com/National-Geographic-September-1987-Vol/dp/B000ROQMBA

or cheaper on eBay:
https://www.ebay.com/i/332587592651?chn=ps&dispItem=1

I found several copies of it but did not know where they are now. Good read though.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: David Tue, Mar 27, 2018

Sothery's.....I would not be happy paying this, that, or any other high price without going through the laboratory, but of course they would know better. The piece looks new. Wow, just goes to show how hard this is.....

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Teck Wed, Mar 28, 2018

Good and beautiful

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Corey Mon, Apr 02, 2018

I don't know if the link I posted to the GIA article is not working for Super, or what, but the article points out four major nephrite deposits within the borders of present days mainland China; Geermu, Xiuyan, Luodian, and Liyang, besides the two locations in Xinjiang.

FYI: GIA or Gemmological Institute Of America is one of the most respected the gemological institutions in the world. I find it very hard to belive the data in the article should not be factual.

Subject:Re: Jade Blade
Posted By: Pipane Fri, Jun 22, 2018

interesting ... it looks old or really really well done copy..

could you post picture of the surface but with the light reflection that we can the surface patina ?

and pictures of the back of the edge ?

I have a good feeling I would like to confirm...


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